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 Tamiya Electronics Experience?

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Glen B
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Tue Jun 24, 2014 7:34 pm

dgsselkirk wrote:

We are all here to have some fun. People can yak all day about realistic play, light tanks, medium tanks, 45 degree defense, speeds, emitter spray, and on and on. Until you have some type of tank certification program in place you are going to be all over the board. Period. And even then realistic? Come on, you want realistic kill ranges you need a football field sized play area. The average engagement range in Russia was 1200 to 1600 Meters, that's 80 to 100 Meters in scale play. We usually get down to final kills under 8 feet! And when we do allies against Axis and you have 6 Tigers on one side and Shermans and maybe T-34's on the other, but realistic? You would need 30 allied to the axis...You want realistic? Go play WOT but put yourself in a closet in a 100 degree room and have your headphones blasting and a can of diesel fuel beside you just for ambiance. Oh and every so often head yourself in the head with a hammer just to simulate concussion blows from the shells that hit but don't penetrate.
 

I think I am one of the last one's here from when the club was founded in 2010.

Concepts change but it was intended to be more of a fun club then a "Danville-style" competition outfit.

I would not want to see it be a no-Tamiya, no play sort of operation, I would probably be gone if that were the case.

I don't mind interfacing with the Black Creek Centre, helping set the field, cutting the grass and other field preparation etc. but I, and I don't think many others, relish the role of being the "tank police".  I just want to go and enjoy the day, like everyone else without having to talk to someone about some problem with their tanks.

My hope is that people will show some consideration and restraint, i.e., I cold make my tanks almost invincible by covering them with camo netting, branches and panzer grenadiers, but I choose not to do this.  The hatch on my early Tiger I would block the receiver, when open, so I made it removeable for when the receiver is installed for IR battles.

Given the technology, realism is not possible, some examples;

An 88mm hit to a Sherman, or a 76mm to a Pz III did not afford 3, 4, 5 or 6 hits, it was usually one  Shocked .

A smaller IR Tank can get in close to a heavy and with the reload time, they can keep shooting and the heavy cannot reply due to its longer recovery time, when in reality, the Tiger, if the crew spotted the smaller tank would be able to take the smaller tank out with one shot, from over at the back door to the Black Creek Centre Building.

IMHO, the best we can do is ask everyone to consider their set up and try to make it as reasonable as possible, I know I do not want to be the tank police and tell people they can't run their stuff on the field.


Back to the Tamiya thing, one advantage of the "alternate" electronics in an HL or Taigen is that you can have more tanks on a given budget.  I started into RC tanks and airbrushing at age 58.  It was a learning curve and I did not like the paint in the first few tanks; being able to buy and paint more of them in a short time was an asset to learning.

In my case, the tanks compete with the expensive hobby of motorcycling, so "bang for the buck" is a benefit, so I guess I will try to iron out the Clark problems and give it another try.

_____________________________________________
"Luck favours the prepared!."
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tomzag
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Tue Jun 24, 2014 8:01 pm

Glen,
you will have no problem, it is nice to have Curtis as club member. Good luck.
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dgsselkirk
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Tue Jun 24, 2014 9:47 pm

Let me be clear here in my concept. There is no tank police. You have all your open class battles no problem everything goes. for the one certified battle,the tank is certified to a set of parameters or it's not.  Really is no grey area... And I'm not saying the parameters have to be that stringent,really, like for starters,can you take hits? Nothing like being on the field and pounding away at some tank that doesn't even register hits. Or how about a tank that at scale moves cross country at 75 mph? Or the emitter who can hit you at 90 degrees to the side and 15 feet away? Trust me I am as guilty as anyone for infractions but with most guys in the club delveloping multiple tanks I think a lot would strive toward having that one machine that is truly up to battle spec and would enjoy battling others knowing that everything was up to snuf. I know this is what I am striving for as well as the modeling aspect and since I can't afford Tamiya or IBU's HL and Clark fits the bill and lets me have a bunch of tanks for at least a 1/2 to 1/3rd the price and someday honestly I hope to build a couple as good as some of yours Glen...

At least these are things to talk about I think...

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"There are things in Russia which are not as they seem..."
Georgy Konstantinovich Zhukov

Too many tanks, not enough time....
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Stince
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:02 pm

I think you guys are missing the point of what I'm try to say.  I don't want the club to turn competitive or exclusive, I just want the club to remain what was original intended for, having fun.

But, I would like everyone to be close to the same settings, so everyone is on equal footing.

We discuss the Clark settings more at http://can-amrctankclub.canadian-forum.com/t1026-clark-discussion-for-club-settings#10974

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HL Panzer III   |   HL Tiger   |   HL Jagdpanther   |   HL Panther   |   Mato Sherman
Hooben Elefant   |   HL Pershing   |   HL Bergepanzer IV   |   Tamiya Leopard 1A   |   WSN T-34
HL "Golden" Pan-Tiger   |   M16 Halftrack   |   HL Panzer IV   |   Tamiya KV-1   |   Tamiya Tiger
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Strato50
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Wed Jun 25, 2014 1:51 am

Glen I'm on Clark board number 8 right now, and so far have had 1 physical failure of the board, and one that came with a defect brand new out of the box.

Said instances where my KV-2 that developed ZERO reverse in one side, the same right-hand side while still being perfectly controllable in forward motion. Clark & Curtis replaced it free of charge.

Second was the original board that went into my Chi-Nu-Kai. I troubleshot the living cr@p out of it, but it simply would not receive a hit. Replaced promptly.



The tradeoff for a cheaper, smaller brand of electronics with excellent programability that are very well suited to our hobby, and integrate rather perfectly with Tamiya systems, is that they are still small-batch produced in China and don't have 100% quality control. If they didn't have the good customer support base they do, I'd have not spoken so highly of them. Between Curtis & "the clark guy", they are quick and helpful.

...I want to see your Panther running along as much as you do!!

_____________________________________________
Tiger I - Panzer III - Panzer IV - Chi Nu Kai - STUG III/G - Panther G*
M4A1 Sherman - KV-2 - T-34/85 - M26A1 - SU-76i - M3 Grant..?*

*under construction
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Airbrushler
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Wed Jun 25, 2014 3:34 am

Strato50 wrote:
Glen I'm on Clark board number 8 right now, and so far have had 1 physical failure of the board, and one that came with a defect brand new out of the box.

Said instances where my KV-2 that developed ZERO reverse in one side, the same right-hand side while still being perfectly controllable in forward motion. Clark & Curtis replaced it free of charge.

Second was the original board that went into my Chi-Nu-Kai. I troubleshot the living cr@p out of it, but it simply would not receive a hit. Replaced promptly.



The tradeoff for a cheaper, smaller brand of electronics with excellent programability that are very well suited to our hobby, and integrate rather perfectly with Tamiya systems, is that they are still small-batch produced in China and don't have 100% quality control. If they didn't have the good customer support base they do, I'd have not spoken so highly of them. Between Curtis & "the clark guy", they are quick and helpful.

...I want to see your Panther running along as much as you do!!




this is what is wrong with mine but i mentioned it from when i first got it long long ago but Curtis never seems to get back to me not just this but with any message i leave

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Freakydude
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:56 pm

I am on again too. What shall we talk about lol I know you from where? I spoke to you when?
No offence their airbrushler but what? do I owe you something? I do believe you bought one board from me a long long time ago, said something about it and I made some suggestions. Then I never heard about it again.
Until recently when you asked me about the Windsor show ( which I have not decided upon. Everybody seems to think it is as easy as just packing a vehicle and off you go but there is tons of planning needed for something like this ) If your looking for an answer don't hold your breath, it will be days before I get around to it.
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Airbrushler
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Thu Jun 26, 2014 12:10 am

you don't owe me anything you never heard about this until now because you never get back to me so i gave up and when do you even have to know someone to have them as  a customer i guess if you don't know me then you wont have to worry about anything  i asked you last year about attending the Muster show to i was only trying to have you there to make sales and have fun Glen and Ian, Derek and Captain Action were there, we know what it takes to do this we done it it was a lot of work  i invited you again but then when you never get back to even to just say hey i will think about it to just ignore someone it's kind of upsetting i was the one who posted your website on this forum if you look, you only got back to me cause i made a stink about it

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Stince
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Thu Jun 26, 2014 12:16 am


Freakydude and Airbushler please take this discussion to PM's or emails.

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HL Panzer III   |   HL Tiger   |   HL Jagdpanther   |   HL Panther   |   Mato Sherman
Hooben Elefant   |   HL Pershing   |   HL Bergepanzer IV   |   Tamiya Leopard 1A   |   WSN T-34
HL "Golden" Pan-Tiger   |   M16 Halftrack   |   HL Panzer IV   |   Tamiya KV-1   |   Tamiya Tiger
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Glen B
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Fri Jun 27, 2014 9:27 pm

I have noticed a few things while reading about the Tamiya kits that give me pause.

Some of them, in "stock" form will run well above scale speed and need modifications to address this; and I set all of mine up to run at scale speed.

I understand that some have a weakness in their gun elevation system.

I see accessories tor things like motor braces.

I know they are fun to assemble and the detail is excellent but I have some concerns about buying a kit in that price range and still having to modify it.

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MikeC
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Fri Jun 27, 2014 10:26 pm

Glen,

If you want scale speed you will have to play with Clark as well. Basically it all depends on the combination of board, motors and gear sets. Just to give you an example, I put in a Tk-22 yesterday on a Taigen Panzer IV metal chassis with what appears to be slightly upgraded motors and the upgraded Mato Black steel gear set (I bought it used as a set) and the thing was whipping around like a race car. I then switched to a Tk35 board which has only 7A (Tk-22 has 20A) and it runs around like the real deal although I didn't check the scale speed. 

My point is that there is no guarantee what the scale speed is on a given combination of board/gears/motors. Because Tamiya has a standard set of gears and motors means at least you know what it is out of the box.

The other option which would be more precise and "tunable" is actually use the radio to control percentage of throttle to give you limits on the top speed.

MikeC.
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Reaper332
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Fri Jun 27, 2014 10:47 pm

The speed of the tank comes down to how you drive it and how you set up your radio gear... My KT's are stock gearboxes with 480's and I have set my Turnigy 9x up with 3 speed config's so it will drive at the speed I choose and still be able to take hits and maneuver around.. Very Happy 

The elevation units at worst I glue the clutch but never really had any probs....
Its only the KT and Tiger 1 that really only need Idler tensioner upgrades, gearbox braces are optional 2 out of 3 of my KT's don't have gearbox braces and all 3 run metal tracks.

Like everything nothing is perfect and everything needs some sort of upgrade... the trouble with Tamiya is the price is all at once unlike say a H/L which you can slowly upgrade as you have the money...

Here is an example... I can get a Tamiya KT delivered to my door from Hong Kong for about $675.
Now I am doing at commission job at the moment on a H/L Porsche KT...It cost him $200 to but it just spent $390 on ELmod Pro another $90 on Mato brass 3:1's plus a Tamiya speaker servo recoil.
So that's already over $700 and still has all plastic wheels and suspension. Prices may be different for you guys up there....????

Just my opinion and I am sure some will disagree... Very Happy Very Happy 

Cheers Ken
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MikeC
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Fri Jun 27, 2014 11:20 pm

Tamiya is about $1,000 Cdn here and Elmod is not popular. I would say most folks would be on stock HL/Taigen with MAKO or Clark which is only about $100 so you are looking at about half the price even if you upgrade the gears and tracks ($350 for the tank) with Clark electronics.

Now if you are into the new JS-2 we would be looking at close to $1,500 Cdn.......

I am glad I am not the only one that plays with the radio to control the speed.......... :-)

MikeC.
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Glen B
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Fri Jun 27, 2014 11:21 pm

As far as speed goes, all of mine have been pretty predictable.

However, I am running a less sophisticated Tactic radio and with SLU's or Clarks, I have got scale speed by installing Mato or Taigen 3:1's, maybe this is just a lucky accident, I don't know.

Anyway, I think I will drop this topic, I do not plan on doing another build for some time so there is no urgency for me to come to any conclusion.

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Reaper332
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Fri Jun 27, 2014 11:46 pm

MikeC wrote:
Tamiya is about $1,000 Cdn here and Elmod is not popular. I would say most folks would be on stock HL/Taigen with MAKO or Clark which is only about $100 so you are looking at about half the price even if you upgrade the gears and tracks ($350 for the tank) with Clark electronics.

Now if you are into the new JS-2 we would be looking at close to $1,500 Cdn.......

I am glad I am not the only one that plays with the radio to control the speed.......... :-)

MikeC.

WOW...... big price difference....
I am surprised Elmod is not popular, is that cause of the price...???
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MikeC
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Sat Jun 28, 2014 12:50 am

Well I guess the problem is the Pacific Ocean and the size of Canada. I guess even if it manages to cross the ocean at a reasonable price at Vancouver, crossing the rest of Canada to come to Ontario would be another factor.

I might be wrong but I don't think anyone in the club is running Elmod. I don't think there is a dealer here. SLUs for sure, but not Elmod. I think SLU is Canadian so that helps too.

MikeC.
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Reaper332
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PostSubject: Re: Tamiya Electronics Experience?   Sat Jun 28, 2014 1:04 am

Thanks for the reply MikeC..... wouldn't thought the prices would have been that high but there you go you learn something new everyday.... thumbs up 

Cheers Ken

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